John the apostle wrote to the early church and expressed the visions which had been given to he, himself, alone, in the revelation of Jesus Christ, given by God. That revelation contained letters to seven churches which were viewed as lampstands with the Son of man seen 'in the midst'. These churches were all subject to the apostle John. *There was unity of teaching.* These churches were singular in the districts in which they existed. *There was no schism.* Many denominations today admit of differences within their numbers. Many allow of their participants following different 'ministeries' and 'leaderships'. If such a state as that seen in Revelation is not real, today, then is it a fact that the Son of man is not 'in the midst' of much of what professes to be the 'church' ? True, he is in the midst where but two, or three, are gathered in his name. Even if it is but one household within a district. Or like-minded persons meeting in a place where many 'churches' exist but none are truly naming Jesus Christ and properly identifying him. My question is adressed to Protestant Trinitarians. Does any Protestant Trinitarian gathering, anywhere, specifically profess to be gathered to the same state and condition as the seven churches addressed by John ? For if gatherings do not so profess, then by so much they are admitting that the Son of man is not 'in their midst'. --------------------------------- Edit, for clarity, regarding comment : There was, indeed, the beginnings of schism at Corinth, as you refer, in the first epistle. This was corrected by apostolic authority and was largely absent by the time the second epistle was completed. Thereafter Paul's writings and the gospel accounts, together with Peter's epistles, Hebrews, James and Jude, were widely available. So by the time John wrote there was a unity *which is very noticeable indeed* in the content of the seven missives to the seven churches. My question is, Who claims to have such a unity, right now, and who, thus, can say that the Son of man is in their midst ?

*"The Apocalypse, or Revelation to John, the last book of the Bible, is one of the most difficult to understand because it abounds in unfamiliar and extravagant symbolism, which at best appears unusual to the modern reader."* The 4 living creatures and 24 elders are mentioned numerous times in Revelation. --- In Revelation 4: >4 Surrounding the throne I saw twenty-four other thrones on which **twenty-four elders** sat, dressed in white garments and with gold crowns on their heads. 5 From the throne came flashes of lightning, rumblings, and peals of thunder. Seven flaming torches burned in front of the throne, which are the seven spirits of God. 6 In front of the throne was something that resembled a sea of glass like crystal. In the center and around the throne, there were **four living creatures** covered with eyes in front and in back. 7 The first creature resembled a lion, the second was like a calf, the third had a face like that of a human being, and the fourth looked like an eagle in flight. 8 The four living creatures, each of them with six wings, were covered with eyes inside and out. Day and night they do not stop exclaiming: “Holy, holy, holy is the Lord God almighty, who was, and who is, and who is to come.” >9 Whenever the living creatures give glory and honor and thanks to the one who sits on the throne, who lives forever and ever, 10 the twenty-four elders fall down before the one who sits on the throne and worship him, who lives forever and ever. They throw down their crowns before the throne, exclaiming: 11 “Worthy are you, Lord our God, to receive glory and honor and power, for you created all things; because of your will they came to be and were created.” In Revelation 5: >6 Then I saw standing in the midst of the throne and **the four living creatures and the elders**, a Lamb that seemed to have been slain. He had seven horns and seven eyes; these are the [seven] spirits of God sent out into the whole world. 7 He came and received the scroll from the right hand of the one who sat on the throne. 8 When he took it, **the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders** fell down before the Lamb. Each of the elders held a harp and gold bowls filled with incense, which are the prayers of the holy ones. The creatures and elders are directly mentioned again in 5:11 and 5:14. In Revelation 6: > 1 Then I watched while the Lamb broke open the first of the seven seals, and I heard **one of the four living creatures** cry out in a voice like thunder, “Come forward.” 2 I looked, and there was a white horse, and its rider had a bow. He was given a crown, and he rode forth victorious to further his victories. This pattern is repeated thrice more in the next passages, 6:3-8. The Lamb breaks the next seal, the next living creature cries out "Come forward", and the next horse and rider emerge. Then in Revelation 7, 14, 15, 19: > 7:11 All the angels stood around the throne and around **the elders and the four living creatures**. They prostrated themselves before the throne, worshiped God, > 14:3 They were singing [what seemed to be] a new hymn before the throne, before **the four living creatures and the elders**. No one could learn this hymn except the hundred and forty-four thousand who had been ransomed from the earth. > 15:7 **One of the four living creatures** gave the seven angels seven gold bowls filled with the fury of God, who lives forever and ever. > 19:4 **The twenty-four elders and the four living creatures** fell down and worshiped God who sat on the throne, saying, “Amen. Alleluia.” --- What does Christian scripture, major/longstanding tradition, or Church teaching tell us about the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders? Note that I am not asking for personal opinions or interpretations of these passages. Please do not post answers that "reason through" the passages, saying "because of X, the elders are probably Y", unless you are quoting or carefully explaining some source that is considered reasonably popular and scholarly by some body of Christians.

Revelation 13 speaks about the beast deceiving the world and causing people to receive the mark of the beast on their right hand or forehead. This raises the question of just how far-reaching Satan’s deception can be on a global scale. If the Bible warns that the entire world will be deceived into accepting the mark of the beast, does this imply that the devil can successfully promote widespread false beliefs and practices on a global level? How does Christian theology understand the devil’s power to deceive nations, especially considering the vast differences in cultures, languages, and political systems? How could Satan maneuver these differences to bring the whole world into unity under a single deception?

Revelation 13:18 (KJV) — *“Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.”* Some Christians point to persistent physical and time-related patterns in creation and human measurement systems that seem to feature “666,” such as: - **Earth’s axial tilt: 90 ∘ − 23.4 ∘ ≈ 66.6 ∘ 90 ∘ −23.4 ∘ ≈66.6 ∘** - **Earth’s orbital speed: ≈ 66,600 mph (depending on units and rounding)** - **Calendar division: 6 × 60 × 60 seconds in a day’s time measurement pattern** - **Barcodes: The guard bars in UPC codes resemble the digit “6” in the barcode system, producing a “666” pattern** Since Revelation calls believers to “count” the number, could such existing patterns be indicators that we are already living in the “beast system”? Or should these be understood as coincidences or unrelated to the prophecy?

In my discussion with some Jehovah Witnesses, they claimed 1914 was the year referred to in revelation and that Satan came to earth. According to their belief, this is why from 1914 the world has never known peace: thus the world wars, famine escalated, and so on... > **Revelation 12:9-12** > > 9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the > Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out > into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him. > > 12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to > the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down > unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a > short time Are there other traditions that agree with this claim? >1 October 1957 Watchtower: “Satan the Devil failed to prove his false accusation against the chief Son of God. ... That is why, when the kingdom was born in heaven in 1914 and war broke out in heaven and the victorious King Jesus Christ hurled Satan down from heaven to our earth, a loud voice in heaven said: “Now have come to pass the salvation and the power and the kingdom of our God and the authority of his Christ, because the accuser of our brothers has been hurled down, who accuses them day and night before our God!” (Rev. 12:7-10) https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1957725?q=satan+1914&p=par

Revelation 9:6 says: >*"In those days men will seek death and will not find it; they will long to die, but death will flee from them." (NKJV)* This seems to describe a period of intense suffering or judgment in which people desire to die, yet are unable to. My question is: does this imply that murder (the unlawful killing of another person) will also be impossible during this time?

In Revelation 17:5, the apostle John describes a mysterious figure: >"Babylon the Great, the mother of prostitutes and of the abominations of the earth." (Revelation 17:5) Many modern interpreters and some Christian teachers associate America with this symbolic "Babylon," citing its global cultural influence, economic dominance, and especially its perceived moral decline (e.g., promotion of sexual immorality, media-driven hedonism, and exporting of ungodly values worldwide). My question is: Do any Christian traditions or interpretations seriously support the view that America is Babylon the Great specifically because of its moral decay? Or is this interpretation more rooted in speculative prophecy teachings rather than established theological frameworks? I’m interested in thoughtful perspectives from within Christian theology, especially those that either support or critique this view using Scripture.

I've asked many people this question, but they all have different opinions. Some say that the beast is a disease or war or something along that line. Others tell me that the beast is an actual beast. I am looking for answers among the broad spectrum of all denominations Christianity. I know there is no way of knowing, but I would just like to know the different beliefs about the *kinds of things* the beast might be. This question refers to ALL of the beasts. I would also like to know what types of denominations think that the end of times have already come.

In Revelation 20:11 (KJV), it says: >*“And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away...”* This verse describes the **Great White Throne Judgment**, a central event in Christian eschatology. However, Scripture does not explicitly say whether the throne itself was created (as part of creation) or whether it is eternal — existing with God before creation. From a Christian theological perspective, is the Great White Throne: - A **created object**, like the rest of the heavens and earth, or - An **eternal and divine seat**, inseparable from God's being? Do any Christian traditions (e.g., Catholic, Orthodox, Reformed, etc.) address the nature and origin of this throne in their teachings or theological writings?

What are the kinds of things the Apocalyptic Beasts in Revelation represent from a Catholic Perspective? Are they the Antichrist, individual kings, kingdoms, etc. I am especially interested in the **First Beast** and **The Second Beast**, which are introduced in **Revelation 13 (RSVCE) **.

Revelation 4:4 describes 24 elders seated around God’s throne, clothed in white and wearing crowns. Many commentators suggest that the number 24 may symbolize the **12 tribes of Israel** (Old Testament) and the **12 apostles** (New Testament), together representing the full redeemed people of God across both covenants. Do Christian scholars or traditions interpret the 24 elders in Revelation as symbolizing the unity of God's people — that is, 12 representing Israel and 12 representing the Church? Are there denominational views (e.g., Catholic, Protestant, Orthodox) that formally teach or reject this interpretation?

Revelation 1:4&5 >John to the seven churches which are in Asia: Grace be unto you, and peace, from him which is, and which was, and which is to come; and from the seven Spirits which are before the throne; vs5) And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness.... Obviously there are three personas addressed in this introduction that provide grace and peace to the churches. How do Jehovah Witness explain the seven Spirits (Holy Spirit) as being a non-person if John addressed Him on an equal basis of respect in this introduction?

In the Revelation chapter two verse thirteen Jesus refers to Antipas being martyred: Revelation 2:13 KJV >I know thy works, and where thou dwellest, even where Satan's seat is: and thou holdest fast my name, and hast not denied my faith, even in those days wherein Antipas was my faithful martyr, who was slain among you, where Satan dwelleth. Mickelson lists the original Greek word as: Ἀντίπας Antipas (an-tee'-pas) n/p. Antipas, a Christian The Greek revised version also uses that same word αντιπας and is also defined as a Christian. So I am confused as to whether Jesus is referring to a specific person named Antipas or simply saying one of his followers, was slain among them.

> For because of the wine of the anger of her fornication all the nations have fallen [victim], and the kings of the earth committed fornication with her, and the traveling merchants of the earth became rich due to the power of her shameless luxury.”—Revelation 18:3 (NWT ) I was wondering if anyone would be able to explain, in what way(s), "Babylon the Great" engaged in "Fornication"?

Revelation 1:8 and 4:8 describe God as the one "*who was, and is, and is to come*", a phrase emphasizing His eternal nature and unchanging presence across time. In contrast, Revelation 17:8 speaks of the beast (often interpreted as representing the devil or a satanic figure), saying it "*was, and is not, and is to come,*" which appears to mimic God’s description but with a distorted twist. **What attribute of God is being emphasized through this triadic formula?** And how does the similar but corrupted version applied to the beast expose the devil's nature as unstable, temporal, or counterfeit? Is this a deliberate contrast showing God's immutability and sovereignty versus the devil's impermanence or false imitation of divine authority?

The Protestant Marko Latvakoski of "The Mission of God" (or a certain "Cory Cornelius"), in the context of Apocalypse 13 supposedly being fulfilled, claims : >Pope Leo XIV declared, “We must dissolve the barriers between faiths {ONE WORLD THEOLOGY} to achieve lasting peace on earth.” Did Leo XIV say this? Latvakoski/Cornelius continues: >The Antichrist is said to perform great acts in the name of peace, seducing the world into worshiping as one. Pope Leo’s unprecedented interfaith push has set off alarm bells for believers everywhere. >

Jesus himself said that there is eternal life and eternal punishment according to Mathew 25:46 >"And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life." John the Revelator, reinforced that by saying that the wicked have no rest day or night in the lake burning with sulfur and brimstone. >"He also will drink the wine of God's wrath... and the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever, and they have no rest, day or night..." (Revelation 14:10-11) Jesus said God will destroy both the body and the soul in the lake of fire, he has not specified whether the destruction is eternal but then the verses above confirm that eternal punishment will be executed on sinners. How do Annihilationists respond?

Both Ezekiel 38-39 and Revelation 20 speak of this ‘entity’ Gog & Magog, both in battle based scenarios. Are these events the same or different? The Revelation 20 version gives a fairly clear, explicit timeline, the Ezekiel account is much more obscure. How can one decipher the timeline for the Ezekiel battle if it differs from Revelation?

Romans 6:23 states: 'For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.' I've understood this is a difficult concept since while some believe it to mean a purely physical death (which we are redeemed from during the end times in our resurrection) others seem to believe that this may simply be a *spiritual* death, entailing disconnection from God? Assuming the physical death is an aspect of this death, how come those who are raptured during the end times are not condemned to death before rising again if the wage of sin is death?

I am only interested in the Evangelical/Protestant or other reformist denominations and sects who come to the conclusion that (insert something from revelation here) is (insert modern person/place/thing here) despite this process repeatedly having failed for the couple hundred years. This is the other side of the "coin" of my other question here . Instead of answering what is the basis of the practice. I'm asking for a kind of reconciling of the logical contradiction of persisting in the practice. Here are some modern examples of people that Christians have "identified the Antichrist" from revelation: The Popes of rome, Napoleon, Hitler, Stalin, Gorbachev, Oliver Cromwell, Vladimir Lenin, Saddam Hussein, Trump, ... and I'm sure in 4-12 years there will be another new one. Here is an example of an event: Chernobyl = Wormwood/Absinth (Revelation 8) Here is an example of a technology: Digital currency from the Chinese/European/etc is easily combined with implanted chips... (oh no, mark of the beast and the inability to buy and sell) --- #### How do they keep their conviction of faith despite being repeatedly disproven by reality? Do they just ignore history? "It never worked before, but I've got it right"? > At a time when more and more people feel the need, because of the profound crisis affecting mankind, to deal with eschatological events as described in the Apocalypse of Saint John the Theologian, as well as those things revealed by the Grace of God to the Prophets, the Fathers of the Church and contemporary saintly elders like Elder Paisios, **we must especially stand with the view of Elder Porphyrios, and decode why such a great Saint of our time, while knowing with precision and detail everything that we are living and where things come from, avoided talking about these things.** (Hieromonk George Kaufsokalyvites ) And so I note at the end here the observation that when the Orthodox Church speaks about the end times and about the second coming, **it is always a hopeful message.** (And consistent, etc)