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Christianity

Q&A for committed Christians, experts in Christianity and those interested in learning more

Latest Questions

23 votes
6 answers
22855 views
When was Job alive?
The [first chapter of Job][1] describes a man who was favored by God (Job). > 1 In the land of Uz there lived a man whose name was Job. This man was blameless and upright; he feared God and shunned evil. 2 He had seven sons and three daughters, 3 and he owned seven thousand sheep, three thousand cam...
The first chapter of Job describes a man who was favored by God (Job). > 1 In the land of Uz there lived a man whose name was Job. This man was blameless and upright; he feared God and shunned evil. 2 He had seven sons and three daughters, 3 and he owned seven thousand sheep, three thousand camels, five hundred yoke of oxen and five hundred donkeys, and had a large number of servants. He was the greatest man among all the people of the East. For whatever reason, I'm assuming he was pre-flood period, but was wondering if there's an estimated time-period he was alive. Looking for potential years (6000BC or something) but also any correction to my assumption it was pre-flood.
Derek Downey (2907 rep)
Sep 6, 2011, 12:28 AM • Last activity: Feb 1, 2025, 12:34 AM
6 votes
4 answers
27756 views
What is the origin of throwing dust over head (as a sign of mourning) in the Bible?
In Job 2:12, when Job's friends first see Job at a distance, they "did not recognize him, and they raised their voices, and wept aloud; they tore their robes and threw dust in the air upon their heads." I know that tearing of one's clothes is a common mourning ritual as portrayed throughout the Bibl...
In Job 2:12, when Job's friends first see Job at a distance, they "did not recognize him, and they raised their voices, and wept aloud; they tore their robes and threw dust in the air upon their heads." I know that tearing of one's clothes is a common mourning ritual as portrayed throughout the Bible, but is throwing dusts upon one's head as well? Where did the mourning ritual of throwing dusts on one's self originate? What is is symbolic of? What other accounts do we have in the Bible for it?
Butterfly and Bones (879 rep)
Jul 26, 2016, 07:13 AM • Last activity: Jan 10, 2025, 05:35 PM
2 votes
4 answers
635 views
How do Christians rationalize Job's children being treated like chess pieces?
I received this "question" from another user who defined immorality as "treating people like things", and must confess that I don't have a ready response. In the book of Job, God permits Satan to kill Job's children in order to test Job. While acknowledging the difference between direct action and p...
I received this "question" from another user who defined immorality as "treating people like things", and must confess that I don't have a ready response. In the book of Job, God permits Satan to kill Job's children in order to test Job. While acknowledging the difference between direct action and permitting, it still seem very... questionable that God would allow other humans to be (ab)used in this manner. (Even more cynically, the user claims that the later children described at the end of the book of Job are 'replacements, as if Job's children are interchangeable'.) What is a (mainstream) Christian response to this objection?
Matthew (12382 rep)
Nov 26, 2024, 02:21 AM • Last activity: Nov 27, 2024, 03:48 AM
1 votes
0 answers
19 views
when did Job live?
One way to find Job’s generation is to count the generations in the family tree for Job's contemporary Elihu (though he was young, and likely in the next generation), and compare them to the Patriarch records. These are the scriptures: Job 32:6: ”And Elihu the son of Barachel the Buzite answered and...
One way to find Job’s generation is to count the generations in the family tree for Job's contemporary Elihu (though he was young, and likely in the next generation), and compare them to the Patriarch records. These are the scriptures: Job 32:6: ”And Elihu the son of Barachel the Buzite answered and said, ‘I am young, and you are very old.” Gen 11:26: “And Terah lived seventy years, and begat Abram, Nahor, and Haran.” Gen. 22:20-23: “Behold, Milcah, she hath also born children unto thy brother Nahor; Huz his firstborn, and Buz his brother… So Nahor-Buz-Barachel-Elihu = Abram- Isaac-Jacob-Judah . That would place the events of Job’s trials about the time of Jacob's sojourn in Canaan. It is curious that Job’s lifespan does not match with Jacob’s at 147, but with Terah (205), Abram (175) or Isaac's (180). However, Job seems to have had a blessing of a long life for his time. Others say Job lived later because of the use of term 'Rahab' (translated "proud") in 9:13 and 26:12; believing the use of this word is significant as it relates to later Egypt. Ps.87:4; Is.51:9.
Wayne Myhre (11 rep)
Oct 26, 2024, 11:10 PM • Last activity: Oct 27, 2024, 02:19 AM
6 votes
1 answers
551 views
If Satan is not a person, how do Christadelphians explain what "satan" was in the case of Job?
This is related to [this other question][1] about the Christadelphian view that Satan is not a person. Here I wanted to ask how they view the case of Job. Job was apparently a real person as he is referred to in Ezekiel 14:14 where God said the words > Though these three men, Noah, Daniel, and Job,...
This is related to this other question about the Christadelphian view that Satan is not a person. Here I wanted to ask how they view the case of Job. Job was apparently a real person as he is referred to in Ezekiel 14:14 where God said the words > Though these three men, Noah, Daniel, and Job, were in it, they should > deliver but their own souls by their righteousness, saith the Lord > GOD. Also James 1:13 says that God cannot be tempted with evil and does not bring about tests upon us just to see if we fail them or not > Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot > be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man: In the case of Job the Bible gives this conversation between Satan and God (Job 2:2-3) > And the LORD said unto Satan, From whence comest thou? And Satan > answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and > from walking up and down in it. And the LORD said unto Satan, Hast > thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the > earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and > escheweth evil? and still he holdeth fast his integrity, although thou > movedst me against him, to destroy him without cause. In the context of Job, do Christadelphians view Satan as a principle of evil within God, some separate entity, or something else?
neo (328 rep)
Jul 8, 2022, 05:11 PM • Last activity: Jun 5, 2024, 10:13 PM
-2 votes
3 answers
1120 views
How did Job and Noah know that they should make sacrifices to God?
The sacrifice system was received after Exodus and is described in Leviticus. Also in Leviticus it is described what clean and unclean animals were. 1. How could Job and Noah know that they should be doing sacrifices and in Noah’s case what clean animals are(Genesis 8:20–21)? 2. How did Job know who...
The sacrifice system was received after Exodus and is described in Leviticus. Also in Leviticus it is described what clean and unclean animals were. 1. How could Job and Noah know that they should be doing sacrifices and in Noah’s case what clean animals are(Genesis 8:20–21)? 2. How did Job know who the real(Jewish) God is, when he was not Jewish and God has not revealed his sacrificial commandments in Leviticus, yet? It seems to me that this is good evidence that Jews invented these stories and put their current understandings in them, not realizing that the people in the stories would not have known about their current Jewish laws. Argument from silence like "well, probably God did tell them somehow" is not a good argument.
CuriousGuy (115 rep)
May 3, 2023, 06:57 PM • Last activity: May 3, 2023, 09:55 PM
2 votes
4 answers
514 views
According to Calvinists, how do Job's works correspond to his salvation?
>**Job 31:1–4 (DRB)** I made a covenant with my eyes, that I would not so much as think upon a virgin. 1 2 **For** what part should God from above have in me, and what inheritance the Almighty from on high? 3 **Is not destruction** to the wicked, and aversion to **them that work iniquity?*...
>**Job 31:1–4 (DRB)** I made a covenant with my eyes, that I would not so much as think upon a virgin.1 2 **For** what part should God from above have in me, and what inheritance the Almighty from on high? 3 **Is not destruction** to the wicked, and aversion to **them that work iniquity?** 4 Doth not he consider my ways, and number all my steps? The very similar New Testament equivalent might be: >**Ephesians 5:1–7 (DRB)** Be ye therefore followers of God, as most dear children; 2 And walk in love, as Christ also hath loved us, and hath delivered himself for us, an oblation and a sacrifice to God for an odour of sweetness. 3 **But fornication,** and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not so much as be named among you, as becometh saints: 4 Or obscenity, or foolish talking, or scurrility, which is to no purpose; but rather giving of thanks. 5 ***For know you this and understand,*** that no fornicator, or unclean, or covetous person (which is a serving of idols), hath inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God. 6 Let no man deceive you with vain words. For because of these things **cometh the anger of God** upon the children of unbelief. 7 Be ye not **therefore** partakers with them. As a *Catholic*, it seems obvious to me from reading this that Job avoids sin in general (something for which Scripture praises him: cf. 1:1), but here fornication or thoughts thereof, *because* if he did not he would have no part in God, because he would be wicked by definition. This directly links works with justification, and Job lucidly and freely chose to take this course of life ('made a convenant with [myself]') because of the risk of not having done so. But in Calvinism *there is no* even theoretical risk of losing salvation, and therefore no need to avoid sins *so as to avoid* such a fate (i.e., whereas there is motive for avoiding sins which is not a salvific reason, so Calvinists believe). Question -- According to Calvinists, how does Job view his works in relation to his justification/salvation? Thanks in advance. --- 1 Cf. Mt. 5:28.
Sola Gratia (8509 rep)
Feb 12, 2019, 04:40 PM • Last activity: Feb 21, 2023, 03:22 PM
1 votes
2 answers
248 views
Were angels with God in the beginning?
The Book of Job indicates that angels were with God in the beginning, when the heavens and the earth were created > Where were you when I laid the earth’s foundation? Tell me, if you > understand. Who marked off its dimensions? Surely you know! Who > stretched a measuring line across it? On what wer...
The Book of Job indicates that angels were with God in the beginning, when the heavens and the earth were created > Where were you when I laid the earth’s foundation? Tell me, if you > understand. Who marked off its dimensions? Surely you know! Who > stretched a measuring line across it? On what were its footings set, > or who laid its cornerstone— while the morning stars sang together and > all the angels shouted for joy? (Job 38:4-7) Yet it is says elsewhere that angels were created during the six day creation week > Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, **and all the host of > them.** (Genesis 2:1) > > You alone are the LORD. You made the heavens, even the highest > heavens, **and all their starry host**, the earth and all that is on it, > the seas and all that is in them. You give life to everything, **and the > multitudes of heaven worship you.** (Nehemiah 9:6)
Bob (528 rep)
Sep 19, 2022, 03:28 AM • Last activity: Feb 16, 2023, 09:01 PM
3 votes
2 answers
5698 views
Are Job and Jobab the same person?
Is there anywhere in the bible that says Job and Jobab is the same person?
Is there anywhere in the bible that says Job and Jobab is the same person?
Jeena (163 rep)
May 5, 2020, 04:58 PM • Last activity: Jan 11, 2023, 07:37 AM
2 votes
3 answers
388 views
Who was the man God was talking to in Job
Who was the man God was talking to in Job who requested he be tested? [Job 1:6-12 ESV](https://www.esv.org/Job+1/) > **6** Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan also came among them. **7** The Lord said to Satan, “From where have you come?” Sa...
Who was the man God was talking to in Job who requested he be tested? [Job 1:6-12 ESV](https://www.esv.org/Job+1/) >**6** Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan also came among them. **7** The Lord said to Satan, “From where have you come?” Satan answered the Lord and said, “From going to and fro on the earth, and from walking up and down on it.” **8** And the Lord said to Satan, “Have you considered my servant Job, that there is none like him on the earth, a blameless and upright man, who fears God and turns away from evil?” **9** Then Satan answered the Lord and said, “Does Job fear God for no reason? **10** Have you not put a hedge around him and his house and all that he has, on every side? You have blessed the work of his hands, and his possessions have increased in the land. **11** But stretch out your hand and touch all that he has, and he will curse you to your face.” **12** And the Lord said to Satan, “Behold, all that he has is in your hand. Only against him do not stretch out your hand.” So Satan went out from the presence of the Lord. In this passage, it implies that God was talking to Satan. I have long been confused and came across this site. Was he talking to Satan, or perhaps a messenger? Because Satan was banished from the heavens right? I am wondering how this is possible and if it is why? Why would God allow this suggestion?
user60494
Oct 28, 2022, 04:46 PM • Last activity: Oct 28, 2022, 07:33 PM
2 votes
2 answers
274 views
Do Christians use ancient Greek polytheistic connotations when defining the literal meaning of Hell?
**Hell** Christian theology invokes a very frightening image of Hell, which is quite close to how the ancient Greeks envisaged Tartarus. [Wikipedia][1] > In Christian theology, Hell is the place or state into which, by God's definitive judgment, unrepentant sinners pass in the general judgment, **Ha...
**Hell** Christian theology invokes a very frightening image of Hell, which is quite close to how the ancient Greeks envisaged Tartarus. Wikipedia > In Christian theology, Hell is the place or state into which, by God's definitive judgment, unrepentant sinners pass in the general judgment, **Hades** According to the Britannica encyclopedia Hades was the word used to describe Hell in the Greek translation of the Hebrew Bible, and it is quite clear that it is from the infernal regions of ancient Greek mythology that Christians get the image of Hell being a place of fiery gloom and punishment. Britannica encyclopedia > In the Greek translation of the Hebrew Bible, the word Hades is used for Sheol, denoting a dark region of the dead. Tartarus, originally denoting an abyss far below Hades and the place of punishment in the lower world, **Sheol** However, The original word used in the Hebrew Bible to describe Hell, was Sheol, which according to (Job 10:21) simply meant a place where "all" the dead go, with no other connotations and the horrific images they conjure up, implied. Britannica encyclopedia > (Job 10:21). In Sheol, the good and the wicked shared a common fate, much as they had in the Babylonian underworld. The place did not conjure up images of an afterlife, for nothing happened there. It was literally inconceivable, and this is what made it frightening: death was utterly definitive, even if rather ill-defined. **Question** It would appear to be quite clear from the above that Christians today get their image of Hell from ancient Greek mythology, and not from the original Hebrew Bible. Is it not paganism to believe in polytheistic ancient Greek religion? Why do Christians use ancient Greek polytheistic connotations when defining the literal meaning of Hell?
John Strachan (319 rep)
Sep 5, 2022, 03:09 PM • Last activity: Sep 8, 2022, 04:13 PM
0 votes
1 answers
75 views
Is there anything wrong or prejudicial in stoicism?
I'm reading the book of Job, and there is a footnote noting that Job is not a stoic but a man who suffers. I wondered if there's anything wrong with the stoic perspective relating to suffering. I feel that the stoic perspective makes you less empathic and makes you not fully understand the drama of...
I'm reading the book of Job, and there is a footnote noting that Job is not a stoic but a man who suffers. I wondered if there's anything wrong with the stoic perspective relating to suffering. I feel that the stoic perspective makes you less empathic and makes you not fully understand the drama of life, but I'm curious if any wise person has discussed this subject. Could someone suggest to me some reading?
m26a (128 rep)
Jun 23, 2022, 07:58 PM • Last activity: Jun 23, 2022, 08:33 PM
4 votes
2 answers
239 views
How do the Church Fathers approach the Speeches of Job's Comforters?
In many places the speeches of Job's comforters are beautiful, they appear to be true, and Paul quotes one of them. Yet, at the end of the book the Lord condemns them for speaking falsely. Yet, all the scripture is God-breathed for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousn...
In many places the speeches of Job's comforters are beautiful, they appear to be true, and Paul quotes one of them. Yet, at the end of the book the Lord condemns them for speaking falsely. Yet, all the scripture is God-breathed for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness. How did the Church fathers deal with this paradox? And how did they use the speeches of Job's comforters?
Kyle Johansen (433 rep)
Mar 29, 2022, 09:18 PM • Last activity: Apr 22, 2022, 12:00 AM
2 votes
1 answers
116 views
Did church fathers express a view of Elihu?
Elihu is a figure in Job, and he can have quite a lot of interpretations, radically different ones as seen on this answer on [Bible Hermeneutics][1]. Is he a repetitive arrogant youth or a prefiguration of Elijah? Did any church fathers express an opinion on Elihu? If so, where and what was it? [1]:...
Elihu is a figure in Job, and he can have quite a lot of interpretations, radically different ones as seen on this answer on Bible Hermeneutics . Is he a repetitive arrogant youth or a prefiguration of Elijah? Did any church fathers express an opinion on Elihu? If so, where and what was it?
Kyle Johansen (433 rep)
Apr 12, 2022, 07:42 AM • Last activity: Apr 13, 2022, 06:30 AM
3 votes
4 answers
486 views
How do Christians who believe that the saints enter a blissful state as soon as they die explain David, Isaiah & Job's pessimistic outlook on death?
I'm specifically talking about the following passages: *David* >“**What profit is there in my death**, > **if I go down to the pit?** > **Will the dust praise you?** > Will it tell of your faithfulness? > [Psalm 30:9 ESV] >4 Turn, O Lord, deliver my life; > save me for the sake of your steadfast lov...
I'm specifically talking about the following passages: *David* >“**What profit is there in my death**, > **if I go down to the pit?** > **Will the dust praise you?** > Will it tell of your faithfulness? > [Psalm 30:9 ESV] >4 Turn, O Lord, deliver my life; > save me for the sake of your steadfast love. >5 **For in death there is no remembrance of you**; > **in Sheol who will give you praise?** > [Psalm 6:4-5 ESV] > 17 **The dead do not praise the Lord, nor do any who go down into silence**. > [Psalm 115:17 ESV] > 10 Do you work wonders for **the dead**? **Do the departed rise up to praise you**? Selah 11 Is your steadfast love declared **in the grave**, or your faithfulness **in Abaddon**? 12 Are your wonders known **in the darkness**, or your righteousness **in the land of forgetfulness**? > [Psalm 88:10-12 ESV] *Isaiah* > 9 **Sheol beneath** is stirred up to meet you when you come; it rouses the shades to greet you, all who were leaders of the earth; it raises from their thrones all who were kings of the nations. 10 All of them will answer and say to you: ‘**You too have become as weak as we**! **You have become like us**!’ 11 **Your pomp is brought down to Sheol**, the sound of your harps; **maggots are laid as a bed beneath you**, **and worms are your covers**. [Isaiah 14:9-11 ESV] > 17 Behold, it was for my welfare that I had great bitterness; but in love you have delivered my life from **the pit of destruction**, for you have cast all my sins behind your back. > 18 **For Sheol does not thank you**; **death does not praise you**; **those who go down to the pit do not hope** **for your faithfulness**. 19 The living, the living, he thanks you, as I do this day; the father makes known to the children your faithfulness. > [Isaiah 38:17-19 ESV] *Job* > 10 But **a man dies and is laid low**; **man breathes his last, and where is he**? 11 As waters fail from a lake and a river wastes away and dries up, 12 **so a man lies down and rises not again**; till the heavens are no more he will not awake or be roused out of **his sleep**. [Job 14:10-12 ESV] > 13 If **I hope for Sheol as my house**, if I make my bed **in darkness**, 14 if I say to **the pit**, ‘You are my father,’ and to **the worm**, ‘My mother,’ or ‘My sister,’ 15 **where then is my hope**? Who will see my hope? 16 Will it go down to **the bars of Sheol**? Shall we descend together into **the dust**?” [Job 17:13-16 ESV] > 18 “Why did you bring me out from the womb? Would that I had died before any eye had seen me 19 and were as though I had not been, **carried from the womb to the grave**. 20 Are not my days few? Then cease, and leave me alone, that I may find a little cheer 21 before I go—and I shall not return— **to the land of darkness and deep shadow**, 22 **the land of gloom like thick darkness**, **like deep shadow without any order**, **where light is as thick darkness**.” [Job 10:21-22 ESV] At face value, it looks like neither David nor Isaiah nor Job believed they would be in paradise, in the presence of God, where they would be able to worship Him and praise Him, as soon as they died. Nor did they seem to have expected to enter into any sort of blissful state. Instead, they refer to death in pessimistic terms, such as silence, darkness, forgetfulness, destruction (other translations say oblivion or nothingness), sleep, worms, maggots, weak, dust, "bars of Sheol", devoid of praise, devoid of hope, etc. In fact, we find similar pessimistic language in Ecclesiastes chapter 9: > 5 For the living know that they will die, **but the dead know nothing, and they have no more reward, for the memory of them is forgotten**. 6 **Their love and their hate and their envy have already perished**, and forever they have no more share in all that is done under the sun. [ESV] > 10 Whatever your hand finds to do, do it with your might, **for there is no work or thought or knowledge or wisdom in Sheol**, to which you are going. [ESV] **Question**: How do Christians who believe that the saints enter a blissful state as soon as they die explain David, Isaiah & Job's pessimistic outlook on death? ____ [Mirror question](https://hermeneutics.stackexchange.com/q/73949/38524) on Biblical Hermeneutics Stack Exchange.
user50422
Jan 26, 2022, 04:22 PM • Last activity: Feb 8, 2022, 04:25 AM
7 votes
4 answers
1215 views
Where does the book of Job come from?
What I mean is the following: - Job stands out as being as old as the Torah (if not older) - None of the characters are Israelites (especially if it was Abrahamic time when Israel didn't even exist) - Every other book can be traced back by tradition, the author is fully unknown So how did the Jews g...
What I mean is the following: - Job stands out as being as old as the Torah (if not older) - None of the characters are Israelites (especially if it was Abrahamic time when Israel didn't even exist) - Every other book can be traced back by tradition, the author is fully unknown So how did the Jews get a hold of Job scriptures? or does it not have an answer and is left to theory?
user29418
Jun 22, 2016, 06:12 PM • Last activity: Nov 2, 2021, 12:14 PM
4 votes
5 answers
10059 views
God and Satan in the book of Job: how did they know about this conversation?
Job chapter 1 vers 6 - 12 talks about God and Satan having a conversation. Where does that story come from? Job does not know what is going on and I have never heard anyone talk about it. Is it a revelation or is it a tradition that helps us understand what was said in this conversation? Who knew an...
Job chapter 1 vers 6 - 12 talks about God and Satan having a conversation. Where does that story come from? Job does not know what is going on and I have never heard anyone talk about it. Is it a revelation or is it a tradition that helps us understand what was said in this conversation? Who knew and who was told that this conversation was going on? (If there is not another Bible verse that can explain this question maybe the RCC or the Orthodox church have a tradition that can explain such a question). The author is not as important; **how did the author know** is the important part.
Northlight2018 (93 rep)
Feb 6, 2018, 04:55 AM • Last activity: Aug 29, 2021, 09:56 PM
-1 votes
2 answers
401 views
How can Satan/the Devil be in a Jewish story (the "Book of Job")?
How can Satan/the Devil be in a Jewish story (the “[Book of Job][1]”? I'm confused. I thought that Jews, and even the entire Old Testament, didn't have any concept of Satan or the Devil? I thought this was purely a Christian/New Testament thing? Yet this story apparently involves: > The prologue on...
How can Satan/the Devil be in a Jewish story (the “Book of Job ”? I'm confused. I thought that Jews, and even the entire Old Testament, didn't have any concept of Satan or the Devil? I thought this was purely a Christian/New Testament thing? Yet this story apparently involves: > The prologue on Earth introduces Job as a righteous man, blessed with wealth, sons, and daughters, who lives in the land of Uz. The scene shifts to Heaven, where God asks **Satan** (Hebrew: הַשָּׂטָן‎ – haśśāṭān, literally "the accuser") for his opinion of Job's piety. **Satan** answers that Job is pious only because God has blessed him; if God were to take away everything that Job has, then he would surely curse God. God gives **Satan** permission to take Job's wealth and kill his children and servants, but Job nonetheless praises God: "Naked I came out of my mother's womb, and naked shall I return: the Lord has given, and the Lord has taken away; blessed be the name of the Lord." God allows **Satan** to afflict his body with boils. Job sits in ashes, and his wife prompts him to "curse God, and die", but Job answers: "Shall we receive good from God and shall we not receive evil?" Have I fundamentally misunderstood something?
Giovante T. (19 rep)
Aug 16, 2020, 07:58 AM • Last activity: Jun 12, 2021, 04:19 AM
5 votes
1 answers
3621 views
Are Job's seven sons and three daughters in Heaven?
At the end of Job, God blessed him and gave him twice as much as he had in the first part of his life but he still has seven sons and three daughters. Is it a common interpretation that his first seven sons and three daughters who were killed are alive in heaven? This would be twice as much--fourtee...
At the end of Job, God blessed him and gave him twice as much as he had in the first part of his life but he still has seven sons and three daughters. Is it a common interpretation that his first seven sons and three daughters who were killed are alive in heaven? This would be twice as much--fourteen sons and six daughters. What are other interpretations from groups that would find the former interpretation unacceptable?
77 Clash (968 rep)
Aug 29, 2013, 08:52 PM • Last activity: Jun 5, 2021, 08:30 AM
1 votes
0 answers
124 views
Is the basic point of Book of Job that God is too intelligent for a human to understand, and whatever he decides actually has a good overall purpose?
I've tried to read "Book of Jobs". I simply don't have the peace of mind and "practical time" to do it, just like with many other things. However, I've watched and read multiple different summaries of it. None of these spell it out in a clear manner, but from what I can tell, the basic "explanation"...
I've tried to read "Book of Jobs". I simply don't have the peace of mind and "practical time" to do it, just like with many other things. However, I've watched and read multiple different summaries of it. None of these spell it out in a clear manner, but from what I can tell, the basic "explanation" is: 1. God is good, no matter what he does. 2. Us humans cannot possibly understand what He plans, and even though it appears like it, his actions are actually not evil after all. You just don't see it (yet?). 3. There is no point in trying to understand His actions, because we are simply *unable* to comprehend it, so just believe that He is good and ignore whatever injustice or horror you witness or are subjected to. Just like with the concept of "free will", which is fundamentally, logically impossible for a creature who didn't "pick their own biology" beginning from some kind of neutral state, I have a major problem with this explanation of God's apparent evilness: "You just can't understand it!" There are many things I don't understand in detail, such as advanced physics. However, I can still reason about them at some level. It is possible for a scientist who is very intelligent to explain intricate concepts on a "high level" to somebody like me; I don't need to be as smart as them or spend 30 years in a lab to understand the basic idea of how a man-made contraption can go from here to some distant planet. The same ought to be true for this; maybe there is a highly complex reason for God doing what he does, but then I wish to know about that reason, simplified to a point where I, a stupid human, can comprehend it. Not just "you can't understand it, period". My back is hurting beyond words as I'm typing this. I'm all alone, with nothing but pain and misery in my life. The worst bullies -- truly evil people -- who I grew up with are now all living in mansions (literal mansions) with beautiful wives and kids and careers. A mentally weaker person than I would've committed suicide long ago in my situation. Frankly, I mostly don't because I'm too much of a coward. I'm going to be forced to endure this existence until I die from natural causes or somebody murders me. Or maybe until God regrets treating me this way and finally starts being nice to me. It is not possible for me to praise God as being good, because he really doesn't seem to be to me. That he appears to be to others, who are far less deserving, just further reinforces this perception. To then hear that I'm just a stupid human who doesn't "get it" feels incredibly insulting, so I really hope that this is not really the point of Book of Job. What is the basic point of the Book of Job? Is it simply that "if you believe, against all rhyme and reason, that God is actually good, no matter how much proof you get of the opposite, he will eventually be good to you because you believed"? If this is the case, I find God's reasoning to be very strange. I literally don't get it.
Denley (11 rep)
Sep 28, 2020, 10:52 PM
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