Why was «کریسمس» (*kerismas*) loaned from English? Wasn't there an indigenous Christian presence which could of given a word of a differing etymology?

It is well known that the word behind Christ-'**mas**' (shortened form of 'Christ's Mass ) is '**mæsse**', which comes from the Latin '**missa**', the same word used for the Roman Catholic **'Mass'** / Holy Eucharist. Are there historical accounts which show that the Christian use of the term 'missa' is (hopefully) coincidental and that we are not accidentally celebrating a feast that initiated with, and is closely connected to the Roman Catholic mass, which is **obligatory** on both Dec24 & 25th?

As a Roman Rite Catholic, January 1 is a Holy Day of Obligation. It is not so in the Ukrainian Catholic Church. If I attend Divine Liturgy at the Ukrainian Catholic Church on January 1, will that fulfill my obligation as a Roman Rite Catholic?

Since we know that Yeshua was born during the time of Herod, and Herod died shortly after the lunar eclipse on January 10th, 1 BC, we can use this as a reference point for the birth and death of Yeshua. In Matthew 12:40, Yeshua mentions being in the grave for "three days and three nights," just as Jonah was in the belly of the fish. Celebrating from Friday to Sunday does not fulfill this timeframe. Yeshua, adhering to Torah, would have begun his ministry at the age of 30, around 31 AD. He was crucified the next Passover. Why follow a timeline known to be incorrect? The death of Christ aligns with Passover, allowing us to accurately date and celebrate His sacrifice on Passover each year. In 31 AD, Passover fell on a Wednesday, and Yeshua was crucified that day. He rose early on Saturday morning (the Sabbath), fulfilling the "three days and three nights" prophecy. The Council of Laodicea shifted the focus away from the Sabbath, a commandment unrelated to the "New" Covenant but still a commandment. Dismissing one of the Ten Commandments makes little sense. Avoiding shared observances with Jews is not a valid reason. Celebrating with symbols like bunnies and eggs, or Christmas trees, mixes pagan traditions with Christian observances, deviating from the Word of God and adhering to human traditions instead of scripture. Both Christmas and Easter are man-made holidays. According to Genesis 1, a new day begins at sunset, a principle that should remain unchanged as God's Law is eternal. --- The question is why is the tradition of Easter "Friday to Sunday" when passover is on a wednesday?

One of the arguments in favor of the traditional date of December 25 being the actual date of Jesus birth is that of church tradition. Of course, it's possible that the early church just picked a date connected with the winter solstice to celebrate the birthday of Jesus. The scholar Ray Butterworth points out how the Queen's Birthday, is celebrated on the second Saturday in June in the UK, and the Monday before May 25 in Canada, regardless of her actual birthday. However, it is plausible (perhaps even probable) that Mary, the mother of Jesus, might have spoken to the disciples in the early faith communities about the specific symmetrical period and days of Jesus' conception and birth. While one might argue that was improbable that there was a perfect symmetrical time of 9 months between the conception of Jesus and his birth, C.S. Lewis made a compelling observation: > You must develop a nose like a bloodhound for those steps in the > argument which depend not on historical and linguistic knowledge but > on the concealed assumption that miracles are impossible, improbable, > or improper. And this means that you must really re-educate yourself: > must work hard and consistently to eradicate from your mind the whole > type of thought in which we have all been brought up. (Miracles) A good discussion on stackexchange on the matter of whether it was appropriate for Jews to celebrate birthdays can be found here. The quote from Rabbi Mendy Kaminker, in support of Jews celebrating birthdays, is particularly relevant. The first century philosopher Plutarch writes: > ...they are those that tell us that, as the Greeks are used to > allegorize Kronos (or Saturn) into chronos (time), … Lucian of Samosata (AD 120-180) describes the festivities of *Saturnalia/Chronos*, as seven day event. Marcus Valerius Martialis in his also speaks of the *Saturnalia* being a seven day event (Epigrams, 72, Book XIV). These authors wrote prior to when the *Sol Invictus* was highlighted and celebrated as a Roman holiday in the fourth century. Changes to the Roman calendar moved the climax of *Saturnalia/Chronos* to December 25th, around the time of the date of the winter solstice. So, if December 25th was the birthday of Jesus that Mary shared with the disciples, it may very likely be a type of double entendre when the Apostle Paul writes: > ...when the fullness of time (chronos) had come, God sent forth his Son, > born of woman, born under the law, to redeem those who were under the > law,... (Galatians 4) In other words, the primal origins of Christmas can be found in a rebranding of *Saturnalia/Chronos* in line with longings of a mythical golden age coming in Jesus in terms of both time (*chronos*) and spatial (literal) history. In scanning the internet I have come across multiple references to Theophilus (A.D. 115-181), bishop of Caesarea in Palestine: > We ought to celebrate the birthday of Our Lord on what day soever the > 25th of December shall happen. - Magdeburgenses, Cent. 2. c. 6. > Hospinian, De origine Festorum Chirstianorum. The problem is that I can't find the original source for this quote. Has it been lost in history? If so, what are some plausible reasons on how this might have happened? In researching the background to the quote from Theophilus, the evidence so far indicates that this quote seems to be based on a fictional account created in Ireland around 600 AD. For example, see this recent research by Roger Pearse. In another line of tradition, McClellan notes that Chrysostom around 407 A.D. (Hom. in diem, natal, ii Col. 351) writes: > It is not yet ten years since this day (December 25) was made known. > Even so, it is now just as seriously observed as if it has come to us > form the the beginning...It is very plain, according to the > evangelist, that Christ was born during the first census, and in Rome > it is possible for any one to deduce, with the aid of the public > archives, when this came about. From persons who have an intimate > knowledge of the records and who still live there and who have kept > the day in accordance with an age long tradition have recently given > us this information. (McClellan, p. 407) Could a large section of the church in those days have forgotten the date of Jesus' birth so easily? If so what are some plausible explanations? Was Chrysostom somewhat limited in his information from other areas? For example, he writes in another place that the charismatic gifts ceased. Yet, other church fathers attest to their continuance. An argument for Clement (150–215 AD) of Alexandria (Stromateis 1.21.145) saying that some hold to December 25th as Jesus' birthday can be found here. The author argues that Clement's 25th day of Pachon should be interpreted along the lines how, "When viewed through the prism of the Athenian calendar, we find that the traditional date of December 25 comes forth quite naturally." Another site, here , argues that Clement held to January 6th as the birthdate of Jesus: > Can we pinpoint the date of Jesus' birth? Various ancient sources lead > us to the answer. Clement of Alexandria (again, about AD 200) says, > "From the birth of Christ, therefore, to the death of Commodus ...are, in all, a hundred > and ninety-four years, one month, thirteen days." If we suppose that > he is using the Roman calendar, we deduce that Clement set Christ's > birth on 18 November 3 BC. But it is highly doubtful that this date, > affirmed by no other ancient source, is the one he so confidently > espouses. We arrive at a different date if we suppose that Clement, a > resident of Egypt, is using the Egyptian calendar without > intercalation. Measuring backward from Commodus' death an interval of > 194 years (each exactly 365 days), one month (thirty days), and > thirteen days brings us to 6 January 2 BC. There is also a mentioning of the December 25th by Hippolytus in his commentary on Daniel (dated 202 A.D.). The quote itself, along with a textual critical approach on the reliability of this reference, can be found here. The total references, included above, push the earliest testimony of the church fathers to the date of Jesus birth on December 25th to the late 2nd century and early 3rd century. A related question can be found here: https://christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/45948/what-is-the-earliest-historical-testimony-of-the-celebration-of-the-nativity-of/45949

I noticed from other questions that Christadelphians do not accept some doctrines shared by mainstream Christian religions, for example that of hellfire or that Jesus is part of a Trinity and is equal to God. They seem to share a view with some other faiths that Christianity was corrupted some time after the 1st century. Based on this I wanted to ask about Christian celebrations that seem to have a pagan origin, such as Christmas. Do Christadelphians celebrate Christmas?

In Luke 2, we get a narration of events surrounding the birth of Jesus. The angels announce the Nativity to the shepherds who are watching over the sheep in fields, mentioning the Town of David as the location and the time of the Nativity as ' today '( Lk 2:11) In Biblical times when the concept of 24-hours' day was not in vogue, day and night were separately counted (Mtt 12:40). The shepherds go to Bethlehem to see the Child (Lk 2:15 ) and return after spreading the news (Lk 2:17-2O) implying that they stayed put in Bethlehem much through the day. It is therefore, possible that Jesus was born in day- time, the news was disclosed to the shepherds after sundown, they set out to Bethlehem early next morning and retuned during the day. But then, Christmas is celebrated in Vigil Service between 24 th and 25 th December, implying that Jesus was born at midnight. The practice perhaps owes its origin more to tradition than to scriptural narratives. My question, therefore , is : Was Jesus actually born at midnight ? Inputs from scholars of any denomination are welcome.

We were singing Christmas Carols tonight and noticed that in the Mormon Hymn book , the following verse has been omitted from, "Hark! The Herald Angels Sing": > Christ, by highest heav'n adored:
Christ, the everlasting > Lord;
Late in time behold him come,
Offspring of the favored > one.
Veil'd in flesh, the Godhead see;
Hail, th'incarnate > Deity:
Pleased, as man, with men to dwell,
Jesus, our > Emmanuel!
Why don't Mormons sing this verse?

For most of the Western world, Christmas is celebrated on December 25. However, Orthodox Christians usually celebrate Christmas on January 7 instead. How did this come to be? Is there a theological difference underlying this difference or is it simply a matter of the Gregorian calendar vs. the Julian calendar?

The Presentation of the Lord is celebrated exactly 40 days after Christmas, yet Christmas ends on the Baptism of the Lord, which is the beginning of Ordinary Time. Why is the Christmas season short when compared to the Easter season, which is celebrated for 50 days? How was it decided that the day celebrating the Lord's baptism marked the end of Christmas?

Whilst reading through various articles on Christmas, I was struck by how the focus seems to be mainly on eating, drinking, giving presents and having a jolly good time. Then I found a partial quote which gladdened my heart, but I can't trace the source although it is dated around the start of the 20th century. It focuses on Mary and Joseph trying to find a place to lodge. They are turned away by many people but one humble shepherd invites them into his hovel. This is what he offers the weary travelers: >I offer you my heart; my soul is poor and bare of virtues, the traws of so many imperfections will prick you and make you weep - but oh, my Lord, what can you expect? This little is all I have. I am touched by your poverty, I am moved to tears, but I havw nothing betterto offer you. >Jesus, honour my soul with your presence, adorn it with your graces. Burn this straw and change it into a soft couch for your most holy body. >Jesus, I am here waiting for your coming. Wicked men have driven you out, and the wind is like ice. I am a poor man, but I will warm you as well as I can. At least e pleased that I wish to welcome you warmly, to love you and sacrifice myself for you. Oh, but that more people would adopt this frame of mind at this time of year! Anyway, I am hoping someone can give me the source of this partial quote written some 123 years ago. It would also be nice if contributors could add any similar Christmas thoughts - something to uplift us. I do so hope this is allowed on CSE?

This year Christmas is on a Monday. My wife read in a neighboring parish's bulletin that we had to go to Mass on the Fourth Sunday of Advent (i.e. sometime Saturday night or Sunday Morning) and this greatly distressed my daughter who unfortunately wants maximum presents and minimum Mass for Christmas. Catholicism.chat told me that: > Paragraph 2180 of the Catechism states that the precept of participating in the Mass is satisfied by assistance at a Mass celebrated on the evening of the preceding day. Therefore, if you attend Mass on Christmas Eve, you fulfill your obligation for both the fourth Sunday of Advent and Christmas. --- So, if a person were to attend a vigil Mass on Saturday, I can see that not satisfying the obligation to go to Mass on Christmas. But, if a person went to Mass at 4:00 PM or later on Sunday, would that satisfy the obligation for both Christmas and the Fourth Sunday in Advent?

I have always had issues with the Bible and thought about God but my life is in shambles and everyone keeps telling me to just believe. So I am coming to get help and understand. When looking into Christ, I have seen that his birthday was set for December 25th. But yet when reading the Bible it says that they follow the star of Bethlehem which this star is not present in the sky until June 26th. Please I want to believe but I need solid proof that this isn't just something people hold onto and this stuff is real and not fake.

This question is a spin-off from https://christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/1360/when-was-christ-born There are differing views on the birth year of Christ, which also affect the dating of the resurrection (as we know Jesus's age on death). Which years are possible, and what are the arguments?

Are we going all round the houses debating whether it was autumn, winter, or spring when Jesus was born, when it’s what the Bible does ***not*** say about the date of his birth that should speak volumes to us? Are we apparently deaf to that? What I mean is that if the date of Jesus’ birth was important, would it not have been clear, in scripture? If God wanted us to note the date of Jesus’ birth, the Bible surely would have stated it? Further, if God wanted us to annually celebrate that birth-date, would there not have been a command to do that, in the Bible? After all, Jesus expressly told his followers to remember his death, even though the exact date of it is debatable, given that the year of his death depends on knowing the year of his birth, and that’s not known as a fact. Yet the omission in the Bible as to any kind of celebration of Christ’s birth stands in stark contrast to the command to remember his death. I'm ***not*** wanting this question to turn into reasons as to why we should celebrate Jesus' birth every year, or not. I just want to know if anyone else has pondered the absence of information about this, in the Bible, and your thoughts. I look for answers from Christians who believe that Jesus Christ “became flesh and dwelt among us” as stated in John 1:1-14, obtaining his human nature from the virgin Mary.

Outside the Sacrifice of the Mass and the use of the Roman Ritual, are there any Catholic historical traditions that are have been or are in use amongst the Catholic faithful for the feast of the Holy Innocents (December 28), either within religious communities or the domestic church?

Could December 25 as the birthday of Jesus have come from Pagan influences? I am asking this due to the information in the following sources: 1. [“NIMROD” – The LORD of Christmas](https://ahayahyashiyaisraelitesunite.wordpress.com/pagan-holidays/christmas/nimrod-the-lord-of-christmas/) 2. [Church of Satan Holiday FAQ](https://www.churchofsatan.com/faq-holidays/) This question is asked for information to engage in solid & meaningful apologetics with pantheists & satanists and not to bash Roman Catholics.The comments to Caleb gives more info.

I just finished watching the movie: [The man who invented Christmas](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Man_Who_Invented_Christmas_(film)) . This got me asking the question: Did Charles Dickens played any real role in renewing (reviving) the spirit of Christmas (in the Christian sense) in modern times. If so, what influences did he produce in doing so? Do any proofs of how he influenced a possible renewal in Christmas exist? Charles Dickens wrote ***A Christmas Carol*** in 1843. As a young man, Charles Dickens expressed a distaste for certain aspects of organised religion. He considered himself a Unitarian. What was Christmas really like where Charles Dickens [lived](https://www.walks.com/blog/charles-dickens-house-in-london/) in London, England in the 1840s? (This was some two hundred years after Oliver Cromwell tried to help ban Christmas!)

From [here](https://archive.ph/ihvxp) : >Happy St. Francis Day! (Oh, And Also Yom Kippur) >It has become a multicultural must to step on Christmas by never mentioning it except in connection with Hanukkah and other “holidays.“ Somehow, however, the MSM neglects to provide the nearest Saint’s day in the Christian calendar to each year’s Rosh Hashanah, Yom Kippur and Passover—there are a lot of saints! So it has become a VDARE.com service (as so often) to fill the gap. We wish a Happy to all our readers. We mean it. He does something similiar [here](https://archive.ph/1MAyh) & [here](https://archive.ph/kRdO7) . Thing is that venerating saints like this is only a Catholic thing correct? Isn't this stepping on the beliefs of other denominations that don't venerate the saints through holidays or the like?

A skeptical argument, from this site , argues that Shepherds would not have been out in the fields with the sheep in late December. The argument runs like this: > Luke 2:8 states that when Jesus was born, shepherds were keeping watch > over their flocks in the fields. According to the Talmud, flocks were > put out to the pasture in March and returned to pens in early > November. That would make Jesus birth sometime during late Spring, > Summer, or early Fall. During late December, the flocks would have > been penned up and would not require 24 hour monitoring by the > shepherds For those believing in a December 25th date for Jesus birth, would the main argument be that the sheep were being brought out so as to get an early start in the morning for temple sacrifices? Or, could there be exceptions for the Talmudic statement? The skeptical article doesn't mention where in the Talmudic their statement comes from. I have not found it. However, in the Mishnah (Baba K, vii.7) found here , it states: > One may not raise small domesticated animals, i.e., sheep and goats, > in settled areas of Eretz Yisrael, as they graze on people’s crops. The Shepherds could have been raising sheep on their own land that they were working on. Perhaps their flocks were destined for temple sacrifices? Bethlehem was an area for growing grapes. Perhaps sheep could have also been brought out in December to fertilize what was growing in the fields - such as grape vines which might also include lower leaf/branch pruning of those vines growing in the fields? Note, this is a legitimate question for Christianity because of the historical implications impacting the tradition of celebrating Jesus' birth on December 25th. It also impacts the integrity of the various oral traditions related to the church fathers. That is to say, is there any reason to not believe that the December 25th date is grounded in the oral tradition of Mary, the mother of Jesus, sharing the date of his conception and birth with the various members of the first century faith community? The micro-climate in Bethlehem was likely similar to weather in California. Many ranchers leave their sheep outside in December. One might argue that the Talmud was not arguing a universal principle on this point. Being out in the cold was an occupational hazard for shepherds. In Genesis 31:34 Jacob is recorded as lamenting his shepherding job, "This was my situation. The heat consumed me in the daytime and cold at night, sleep fled from my eyes." Here is the average temperature for Bethlehem: > The first month of the winter, December, is still a mild month in > Bethlehem, West Bank, with temperature in the range of an average low > of 7°C (44.6°F) and an average high of 14°C (57.2°F). In December, the > average high-temperature drops, from a pleasant 20°C (68°F) in > November, to a mild 14°C (57.2°F). See here . According to Emeritus Professor Epstein, of Animal Breeding at the Hebrew University of Jerusalem, the most common sheep in Israel are the Awassi breed of sheep. They are often left in the open fields even during the evenings. The only exception would be when the temperatures in high altitudes are very low with snow on the mountains. See this article by Epstein. The article also states: > Bedouin and fellahin shepherds know nothing of tent or house but live > entirely in the open together with the flocks under their care. They > are working 365 days a year, from 13 to 16 hours a day. Their work > includes shepherding, watching at night…In Iraq, the principal lambing > season of Awassi ewes is in November, and in Lebanon, the Syrian Arab > Republic and Israel in December-January…