Christianity
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According to Orthodox Church, can a person legitimately be call "Christian" who doesn't believe in Jesus' claim to Deity? (John 6:38, 8:24)
There is much discussion in secular academia about the possibility/impossibility of Christ being a God? And there are sects *within religious circles* who diss the idea of Christ really being Deity. Some of those sects fly under the banner of "Christianity." ***Since a "Christian"--in normal patois-...
There is much discussion in secular academia about the possibility/impossibility of Christ being a God? And there are sects *within religious circles* who diss the idea of Christ really being Deity. Some of those sects fly under the banner of "Christianity."
***Since a "Christian"--in normal patois--is defined as someone who is a disciple of Christ***, it follows that that disciple would believe and teach faithfully whatever the essence of Christ is. But many interpret the Bible as declaring that ***Christ taught He was Deity (God in the flesh)***.
>Israelites...whose are the Fathers, and of whom as concerning the flesh Christ came, who is over all, God blessed forever. Amen. (Romans 9:5)
>I came down from heaven, not to do my own will, but the will of Him that sent me. (John 6:38; also 8:24,42)
>Then Jesus said to those Jews who believed on Him, "If you continue in My word, then you are my disciples indeed. And you shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free. (John 8:31-32)
Note that the second half of this verse is engraved on the portals of Harvard University! Yet none would say that Harvard wishes to promote Christ's divinity.
Could all others who claim to be Christian, whether sect or individual, ***but do not believe in His divinity*** still legitimately fall under the umbrella of the title, ***Christian***? Or is that deceptive? Is that unwarranted? ***Is that contradictory to the words of Jesus in these verses?***
>For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form. (Colossians 2:9, NIV)
ray grant
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May 16, 2025, 10:28 PM
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Only God and Jesus Christ are referred to as 'Saviour'. Why then do some denominations teach that Jesus Christ is not 'God'?
The word 'Saviour' (σωτήρ, *soter*) is used twenty-four times in the Greek New Testament scriptures. Eight times, this refers to 'God'. Sixteen times it refers to 'Jesus', 'Christ', 'Jesus Christ', 'Lord Jesus Christ', and 'The Son'. One notable time, the wording used is 'the great God and Saviour o...
The word 'Saviour' (σωτήρ, *soter*) is used twenty-four times in the Greek New Testament scriptures. Eight times, this refers to 'God'. Sixteen times it refers to 'Jesus', 'Christ', 'Jesus Christ', 'Lord Jesus Christ', and 'The Son'.
One notable time, the wording used is 'the great God and Saviour of us, Jesus Christ', Titus 2:13, and here I am quoting the original, literal, in which the Greek idiom known as 'Sharp's rule' should be noted.
No other person is called a 'saviour' in the Greek New Testament.
Moses is referred to as a 'deliverer', the proper translation for λυτρωτῆς, *lutrotes*, in Acts 7:35, in regard to a national, not a spiritual, deliverance: and Noah is said to have 'saved' his household (from a flood, not a spiritual salvation) in Hebrews 11:7 when God was the Saviour by his warning Noah of the future flood.
The salvation of one's own soul ; the salvation from one's own, personal sins; the salvation of oneself in regard to the sin which entered into the world and humanity in general; the salvation of one's body in resurrection: all are the province, solely, of 'God our Saviour' and of 'the God and Saviour of us, Jesus Christ.'
In the light of this evidence, why do some suggest that Jesus Christ is not 'God' when the evidence appears to be, very substantially, in favour of the opposite conclusion?
The list of eight references to 'God our Saviour': Lk 1:47, 1 Ti 1:1, 2:3, 4:10, Titus 1:3, 2:10, 3:4, Jude 25.
The list of sixteen references to Christ as Saviour: Lk 2:11, Jn 4:42, Ac 5:31, 13:23, Eph 5:23, Phil 3:20, 2 Ti 1:10, Titus 1:4, 2:13, 3:6, 2 Pe 1:1, 1:11, 2:20, 3:2, 3:18, 1 Jo 4:14.
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All references and quotations relate to the TR Greek text and to the KJV translation of that text.
Nigel J
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Apr 16, 2025, 08:44 AM
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Does Jesus ever not have a God according to Protestants?
> John 20:17 Jesus said to her, “Do not cling to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father; but go to my brothers and say to them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.’” > Eph 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ... > Rev 1:1 The revelation...
> John 20:17 Jesus said to her, “Do not cling to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father; but go to my brothers and say to them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.’”
> Eph 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ...
> Rev 1:1 The revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave him...
> Rev 3:12 The one who conquers, I will make him a pillar in the temple of my God...
> Rev 22:1 Rev 22:1 the throne of God and of the Lamb...
These samples from scripture express that Jesus *has a God* (who is the Father alone John 17:3), and is the same God all other humans have.
Clearly, nothing seems to have changed from being in the flesh, and being exalted to the heavens to be *with* God and by the side of God.
Typical explanations are that Jesus has a God *while he is a man* (while still being God apparently) so that seems to lack some credibility.
Does Jesus ever not have a God according to Protestants?
steveowen
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Apr 11, 2025, 11:25 AM
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Does Rev 22:6 and Rev 22:16 prove in black and white that Jesus is God?
I was having a Bible discussion with my Christian brother this morning and we happened to bump into this verse in Revelation chapter 22 that actually confirms Jesus is God indirectly. Our subject is on the identity of the sender who sent his angel to show John this vision. If we look at the statemen...
I was having a Bible discussion with my Christian brother this morning and we happened to bump into this verse in Revelation chapter 22 that actually confirms Jesus is God indirectly. Our subject is on the identity of the sender who sent his angel to show John this vision. If we look at the statement made by the angel to John and the corresponding affirmative statement made by Jesus then we can infer that the sender who is the **God of the prophets** is actually **Jesus Christ**.
*Revelation 22:6*
> And the Lord, the God of the spirits of the prophets, has sent his angel to show his servants what must soon take place
*Revelation 22:16*
>I, Jesus, have sent my angel to testify to you about these things for the churches
So from both verses it can be concluded that the **sender** is **God** aka **Jesus Christ**, is this the case?
So Few Against So Many
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Dec 8, 2024, 09:12 AM
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