Christianity
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Does Augustine ever say that Christians in his time identify their Deus [God] with the Roman deity Saturn?
I first encountered this notion on p. 30 of R.S. Sugirtharajah's book *The Bible and the Third World: Precolonial, Colonial and Postcolonial Encounters* (2001, Cambridge University Press). In reference to the ancient Roman territories of the African continent, he says (with my own emphasis added bel...
I first encountered this notion on p. 30 of R.S. Sugirtharajah's book *The Bible and the Third World: Precolonial, Colonial and Postcolonial Encounters* (2001, Cambridge University Press). In reference to the ancient Roman territories of the African continent, he says (with my own emphasis added below) that:
> The Christianity which came to Africa was initially hellenized and
> eventually adapted itself to Egyptian language and culture. This
> adaptation was facilitated by the infusion of native religion and
> rituals. It contained elements from non-Christian religions.
> **Augustine, in one of his tracts, mentions that in the fifth century Christians believed that God was Saturn re-christened.** The
> Christianity practised both by sophisticated thinkers like Tertullian
> and ordinary people had as much in common with the practices of their
> indigenous religion as with the new faith.
This paragraph is footnoted with: "See Susan Raven, *Rome in Africa* (London, Routledge, 1993), p. 168."
A look into the cited page of Susan Raven's book *Rome in Africa* supplies the following (again with my own emphasis):
> But the Christianity of the African poor—and even of intellectuals
> like Tertullian—had much in common with the religion it displaced. The
> new Semitic God was, for the superstitious Africans, the old Semitic
> Saturn-Baal writ large: a God of Vengeance to be feared and
> propitiated, rather than a loving Father. It was 'a transformed
> popular religion, rather than ...conversion to a new religion'.
> **Indeed, one of St Augustine's tracts suggests that many fifth-century Christians believed that God was Saturn re-christened**;
> and the old god's nickname, *senex*, the Old Man, may have been
> applied by extension to Christian bishops, even though the name of
> Saturn seems to have vanished more than a century earlier.
In the context of the region's religious history, Raven (and Sugirtharajah by extension) seems to be here implying that the Christianisation of the area was, especially at the popular level, an additional veneer of syncretisation which had been occurring since the Phoenicians landed in Africa centuries previously, bringing with them the worship of Ba'al-Hammon, with whom the Roman Saturn was later identified once the Romans had colonised Phoenician Africa.
Of what I have been able to find, the closest to what these authors are talking about, is an argument made by Augustine in his work *De Consensu Evangelistarum*, "On the Harmony of the Evangelists" (which I have also seen referred to as *De Consensu Evangeliorum*, "On the Harmony of the Gospels"), specifically in Book 1 (particularly around Chapters 22-25).
In this text Augustine does indeed address syncretisation, but he nowhere, so far as I can tell, accuses Christians of such a practice. He is arguing against the Roman custom or doctrine of ensuring to worship all the deities that one encounters, and he cites certain Roman poets and other writers as equating the God of the Hebrews with their own Saturn or Jupiter.
For the most part, however, he is engaged in a debate positing the apparent contradictions of identifying two or more deities with each other, such as was done, e.g. with Jupiter and Saturn, of whom there exist stories about the two gods actually being each other's enemies. A big part of his argument follows the complaint that it doesn't make sense to claim that the deity worshipped by Jews and Christians is the same as Saturn (or Jupiter), primarily because the former demands exclusive veneration.
As for the divine nickname of *Senex*, this also receives a mention (at the end of Book 1, Chapter 23) but it is in regard to Carthaginians apparently shying away from calling their deity specifically Saturn and opting rather to call him the Ancient or Old One.
**Is there anything in the corpus of Augustine's literature in which this African writer says that Christians themselves during his time (or, really, at any point in history) equated their God with the Roman Saturn (or some other deity)?**
Or is what Sugirtharajah quotes from Raven maybe simply an inaccurate representation of statements made in *De Consensu Evangelistarum*? (It could be that I'm looking in the wrong place among the prodigious number of works which I've heard that Augustine penned.)
Adinkra
(400 rep)
Jun 26, 2019, 12:47 PM
• Last activity: Jul 26, 2019, 08:23 AM
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Are there any Christian denominations that incorporate Odinism?
Are there any Christian denominations or specific churches that incorporate Odinism or Odinistic cultural traditions? Perhaps, as a way to show that the original religion of northern Europe was not to be destroyed but revealed through Christ? For example, Odinists state: > The calendar in use by Odi...
Are there any Christian denominations or specific churches that incorporate Odinism or Odinistic cultural traditions?
Perhaps, as a way to show that the original religion of northern Europe was not to be destroyed but revealed through Christ?
For example, Odinists state:
> The calendar in use by Odinists in this country today is based on some
> of the festivals most widely celebrated by our ancestors, especially
> those which have survived as part of our people's folklore. **Many
> church festivals have incorporated elements of heathen customs; and it
> is now our task to 're-paganise' them.**
[All About Odinism](http://www.odinistfellowship.co.uk/)
Greg McNulty
(4074 rep)
Jul 4, 2015, 08:09 AM
• Last activity: May 24, 2018, 04:00 PM
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Where, if anywhere, is it explicitly stated that the Church may borrow and adapt heathen feasts?
I *think* I remember having read some official document of the Catholic Church (maybe even of Vatican II) explicitly stating that the Church, while establishing the Faith in a heathen area or culture, does not always need to fight the existing heathen rituals and feasts; rather, in certain cases, it...
I *think* I remember having read some official document of the Catholic Church (maybe even of Vatican II) explicitly stating that the Church, while establishing the Faith in a heathen area or culture, does not always need to fight the existing heathen rituals and feasts; rather, in certain cases, it may borrow and adapt these feasts, leaving many rituals but making them compatible with the Christian theology.
**Now it is not my intention to discuss this particular holiday**, but just to make clear what I mean: I’ve heard people claiming that in this very fashion the Christian feast of Christmas was established, drawing its origins from the heathen feast of the Sun. (I’ve also seen people debunking this theory, though).
Do I remember correctly that such a statement has been made in official documents of the Church? If so, where can it be found?
gaazkam
(1115 rep)
Oct 30, 2016, 05:23 PM
• Last activity: Oct 31, 2016, 02:06 PM
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What is the origin of the Evil Eye in Christianity?
My family owns several charms—such as necklaces, bracelets, and small stones—with the [Evil Eye](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evil_Eye) symbol on it. My family is Christian, and if I remember correctly the Evil Eye is of Turkish origin. This would imply that the Evil Eye has Muslim roots. What could...
My family owns several charms—such as necklaces, bracelets, and small stones—with the [Evil Eye](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evil_Eye) symbol on it.
My family is Christian, and if I remember correctly the Evil Eye is of Turkish origin. This would imply that the Evil Eye has Muslim roots.
What could possibly explain why my Christian family owns items of Muslim origin? The artistry of the piece is indeed something that would warrant owning it, but my mom has spoken to me of it religiously, in that it "wards off evil spirits."
user92
Aug 30, 2011, 10:38 PM
• Last activity: May 13, 2016, 02:05 PM
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When, how and why did Mary start to be called "Queen of heaven"?
I have four closely related questions on this topic (if overall this is considered too broad, I'm happy to receive advice as to which questions—if any—would be better off in a separate post): 1. What is the earliest documented use of the term "Queen of Heaven" being applied to Mary, the mother of Je...
I have four closely related questions on this topic (if overall this is considered too broad, I'm happy to receive advice as to which questions—if any—would be better off in a separate post):
1. What is the earliest documented use of the term "Queen of Heaven" being applied to Mary, the mother of Jesus? (cf. Wikipedia on *the Virgin Mary as Queen of Heaven* - there seems to be a contradiction between the first and second paragraphs in this section ).
2. Given that the only Biblical references to this title are regarding a false goddess being worshipped in the nation of Judah during Jeremiah's time (cf. Wikipedia's *Queen of heaven (antiquity)* ), is there evidence of any discussion or dissent (over whether such a title was in any way appropriate) in evidence in the wider church when this title was being adopted and disseminated (prior to the Reformation)?
3. Are there any arguments from Church Fathers or other historical records of why such a title would have been adopted in the first place?
4. It seems on the surface (at least to some) that this might be an example of Syncretism , but perhaps there are convincing arguments that can exclude that possibility - if so what would be the outline of such arguments? Or otherwise, what additional evidence (ie not covered in 2. or 3.) would support the idea that this *is* an example of Syncretism?
*Please note: I'm looking for answers that are supported by quotes from Church fathers and Church historians, not doctrinal expositions from denominational perspectives. I'm only looking for a very brief outline of an argument (one way or the other) to question 4 (one or two paragraphs maximum) - if there are the seeds of a worthwhile further question to be developed from such responses, I will ask a separate question to elicit a more detailed answer."
bruised reed
(12676 rep)
Dec 8, 2014, 01:46 PM
• Last activity: Dec 9, 2014, 06:05 PM
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What is the current Catholic church's view on Haitian Vodou?
Haitian Vodou is the syncretic result of African spiritual systems and Catholicism, basically _merging_ as a result of the transatlantic slave trade and travel to the new world. Many Haitians who practice Vodou consider themselves Christian. What does the Catholic church currently think of it?
Haitian Vodou is the syncretic result of African spiritual systems and Catholicism, basically _merging_ as a result of the transatlantic slave trade and travel to the new world. Many Haitians who practice Vodou consider themselves Christian.
What does the Catholic church currently think of it?
rpeg
(2245 rep)
Jan 15, 2014, 04:43 AM
• Last activity: Jan 31, 2014, 01:38 AM
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